Brake Help

For anything that doesn't fit the other forums.

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Mark R. Obtinario
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Post by Mark R. Obtinario »

You might try riding your brakes and get the brakes nice and warm. It will tend to get rid of any minor rust problems on the drum. Be careful doing this if your linings are comtaminated as they can catch on fire rather easily.

I have had problems of brakes grabbing on vehicles that have sat around quite a bit. Riding the brakes for a short period of time usually got rid of the problem.

I have found it works on both hydaulic and air brakes.

If you are having problems getting brake parts at your local parts house you will need to go to a parts house that caters to trucks more than car parts. If that doesn't work you may need to go to a business that specializes in brake parts, some place like www.ottsfrictionsupply.com.

As you have your brakes all disassembled, make sure you clean, inspect, and repack all of the wheel bearings properly. Good oil/grease seals are also very important.

You don't want to go to all of the trouble of removing a wheel to work on the brakes to have to take the wheel back off and redo the brakes because a wheel seal failed.
Stealth Camper
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Post by Stealth Camper »

Some of the NAPA's here in Oklahoma have decent stock of truck brake parts. There are also regular truck places, but since I haven't had to do any brake work yet, I don't know if NAPA is really any good or just holding some parts.
Mark R. Obtinario
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Post by Mark R. Obtinario »

I think every NAPA can choose which lines they stock and how much of any particular line they keep on hand. I am thinking a suburban NAPA store is going to stock more car and light truck parts than heavy and medium duty truck parts.

But if your local NAPA store doesn't have your part but has a good person behind the counter that can use the computer parts database they can get any part in the NAPA inventory.
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Post by teamgreen »

I've been using NAPA primarily. What I like to see is someone who isn't afraid to open the old books under the counter. That's where all the info is. It doesn't seem like everything has made it on to their computers yet. They have to open a book to find my B500. Their computer doesn't cover it. I'm getting good at finding things though. My daily driver is a 45 year old International. Thanks for all the advice. Oh, and while checking everything out I found a small drip starting from the back of my master cylinder. Back to napa.
teamgreen
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Post by teamgreen »

I'm beginning to get frustrated with this. Maybe a better description of whats happening is a total LOCK UP of one front wheel or the other. I've had 30 something odd vehicles and never experienced anything like this. I am taking into account everyones advice on parts replacement but I just want to make sure I am buying the right $tuff.People who know about brakes are familiar with the way drums brakes self actuate. Well, as soon as I apply a little pressure, one of my front wheels engages HARSHLY. Sorry, I'm not expecting new answers as I probably need to just buy everything. I just wanted to vent a little. I have this obsession with understanding how things work and why they don't. It helps me never have the same problem twice(in theory) :?
Bob
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Post by Bob »

I know just how you feel. Although I don't have any answers..I wish you luck and I KNOW you will get it figured out soon! :idea:
Wherever I am...I am home.
teamgreen
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Post by teamgreen »

Bob, Thanks for the pep talk. I know I'll get it. I'm just anxious to get out of my current living situation and out on the road. Even if it's just for a while. I have been tracing my hydraulic lines and it appears this thing has some sort of split system where one side of the master works one front wheel and one side works the other. Because of the alternating manner of my problem, I think the problem is somewhere in this unfamiliar system.
Mark R. Obtinario
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Post by Mark R. Obtinario »

If front brakes grab it is due to something on the drum or the lining that is causing the brakes to grab.

I would still run around a parking lot with my foot on the brake enough to get the brakes cleaned up. If the drums have rust where the linings have been it would cause grabbing on one side or the other without any consistentcy because the first time you went around a corner the rust spots would not be in the same place on both sides any longer.

If after you have "worn" off the rust and the brakes still grab it would seem to be it would be time to pull the wheels and look inside to see what exactly is going on.

Fouled linings and out of round drums would be the only thing I can think of that would cause the brakes to grab.

The fact that sometimes it grabs on one side and sometimes on the other I would guess that whatever problem you have is identical on both sides but in different spots. Which would tend to make me think you have a problem with out of round drums. Which makes me think it is rust more than anything else.

On one bus I had that would exhibit the same symptoms it would take five or six miles of riding the brakes before they would smooth out.

Good luck.
teamgreen
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Post by teamgreen »

The problem does go away with driving but comes back after it sits for a day or two. I've driven it about 150 miles and had the wheels off 3 times. There's no rust but I haven't had them checked for out of round. It's one thing I can't do at home. That's probably the problem. I located a good NAPA and they have everything except the drums. :roll: I hope these can be machined. Thanks again for your help.
Mark R. Obtinario
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Post by Mark R. Obtinario »

If it goes away then the drums are not out of round.

I would still lean towards rust if the grabbing goes away.

If you have had the drums off and everything seems clean with no brake fluid or grease contaminating the linings then I have to lean towards rust.

It doesn't take much rust to cause grabbing, particularly if you are in a wet/humid locale. Back in the day I can remember getting in a bus on Monday morning only to experience brake grabbing until the brakes had been used a few times.
teamgreen
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Post by teamgreen »

It does go away. When I spin the wheel off the ground, I get a slight rub in one part of the rotation. It must be slightly out of round or there is just a rough spot. I'm suprised it hasn't worn off from driving. I actually emory clothed both drums just to clean them up but maybe there is pitting I'm not seeing. Either way, I am ordering new hardware and shoes. The old springs still had some paint on them so I thought they weren't too old but I guess I should just freshen things up while I'm doing all this work.

I'm just SO happy it's the front and not the rears. The duallys are much more work.
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Headache
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Post by Headache »

I'm going through the rust issue with my car right now. It sits way more than is driven and I get all sorts of noise and some friction until I drive it around town for a good bit of time. The rust comes back just as quickly with the snow melting off, rain, etc that's been going on.
Mark R. Obtinario
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Post by Mark R. Obtinario »

To test brake springs, drop them on the floor.

If they bounce they are still in good enough condition to use.

If they just go clunk on the floor they need to be replaced.

I wouldn't think emery cloth would be abrasive enough to take stuff off of a brake drum that would cause grabbing.

I still think driving around with the brakes lightly applied will do more to rid you of your problem than anything else.
teamgreen
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Post by teamgreen »

The only problem with trying to drive with slight pressure is usually only 3 wheels are turning and one is leaving a black streak of expensive rubber on the street. If I drive with no pressure and very careful stops, it gets better when they warm up. Either way, I like your idea and I will try it some more. It is the cheapest solution and all I can do till I get more part$.
Stealth Camper
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Post by Stealth Camper »

I wonder if there could be some hydraulic issue? Maybe a bubble in a line? Or dirt in a line?

Have you done a good fluid flush? There are some cheap pressure bleed systems out there that work pretty good. I have one that works well. Lisle makes it if my old memory isn't completely gone.

This is strange. Can't really happen. (Yeah, right...)
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