Interiors and exteriors

Discussions about all things to do with buses, trucks, and the homes made within them.

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Stealth Camper
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Interiors and exteriors

Post by Stealth Camper »

Just a couple questions for feedback/input from the group. Little background; I have a school bus (1976 International 1600, 35 foot) that is a work in very slow process of conversion to a hippie bus. (Outside inspired by Ken Kesey, et. al, but with modern home interior.)

Interiors
I have access to a fair amount of juniper logs (aromatic red cedar) and am considering extensive use inside the bus. I have never had a cedar lined closet, so am wondering if anyone has, and if the odor became too much. (Alternative woods are available, and I can relegate the cedar to a closet or chest.) I am concerned about too much of a good thing....

And just how dangerous/practical is a wood stove. Really like the little box stove that Jones (?? if memory serves) has. Very nice. I also already have a small pot belly cast iron that would fit, but lots of loose joints where I could definitely expect to see sparks coming out.


Exteriors
Second, the drive train on this is becoming dated and it has split rims on spoked hubs. Am curious about how big an ordeal it would be to swap out. Have been looking for similar truck with at least "Budd" wheel axles to change with. Would also like to get diesel drivetrain.

Engine and axles swaps are feasible and don't bother me if mostly it is just unbolt, rebolt work with a little mild fabrication. Don't really want to do too much chopping/welding to the frame - am leery about compromising its strength.

Will appreciate any thoughts anyone has.
Jones'n4chrome
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Post by Jones'n4chrome »

Stealth,

If you need to update engine, trans, and axles, you would be money WAY ahead to start with a newer bus. If you are in love with the 1976 IH, and still want to upgrade, then consider swapping your bus body onto a newer bus frame with a diesel engine and the axles you want. It will still be a ton of work, but at least the steering and driveline would be finished. I did it on my 46 Dodge bus, but back then I was in love with the 46.

As far as the wood stove, there is a link called "tips for installing a wood stove" or something like that, check it out.

Chuck
Mark R. Obtinario
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Post by Mark R. Obtinario »

If you haven't started your conversion then updating to a newer bus would be much easier than to swap stuff in and out later.

In regards to what you do have, a Loadstar with a SV345 or SV392 is a pretty rock solid platform. Parts are plentiful and relatively inexpensive. IHC still supports their older stuff fairly well. Most of the parts and pieces are still available from NAPA and other large truck parts houses.

The downside to the gas powered Loadstars is the top speed is best kept to under 55 MPH. Some were governed to 47 MPH. Regardless of rear gearing, fuel consumption will go up exponentially the faster you try to go. It will cruise all day at 3000 RPM's but will blow up at 4000 RPM's.

Average fuel consumption with a manual should be in the 5-7 MPG range and with an automatic in the 4-6 MPG range. A diesel in the same size of bus will get 8-12 MPG.

The question you have to ask yourself is how many miles will you have to travel before you pay back the thousands of $$$ you will have to pay to upgrade to diesel power. Also remember that in a school bus the top speed won't always be all that much faster than what you can maintain with your Loadstar. (I have 1984 S-series IHC bus that is geared to a top speed maximum of 47 MPH.)

Spoke/Dayton/California wheels are still available on new trucks so the spoke wheel isn't obsolete. Don't confuse tube type split lock ring wheels with the type of mounting. Tube type split lock ring wheels come in Budd patterns as well. Swapping over to tubeless is just a matter of purchasing the correct wheel.

For the backyard mechanic spoke wheels are actually a lot more user friendly than Budd wheels--a 1" air wrench is not required to change wheels or work on service brakes.

If your heart is set on diesel power I have a great 1978 Loadstar/Carpenter w/DT466/Allison for sale. It is excess to needs and the wife wants it out of the yard.

Good luck on your journey and remember the only dumb questions are those that are not asked.

Happy trails.

Mark R. Obtinario
Winlock, WA
wstcstslider
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Post by wstcstslider »

Hey Stealth,
I am in the same boat you are having a bus with a little gas drivetrian. It wasn't the bus I wanted but it was free...

I third the, if you haven't got too far with the conversion and have the funds look for a new bus.

I didn't have the funds for the bus I wanted but did have the time to do the conversion so I went ahead with it. In the back of my head thinking "I'll put a diesel in it some day. I did the math that Mark O. was suggesting on how many miles would I have to go to recoup the cost of the conversion. My fuel savings would match conversion price after two cross country road trips, give or take a couple thousand miles. This means I won't be taking the bus cross country until I can afford the diesel conversion. That being said I am still glad I converted the bus I had because it would have been quite some time before I could afford I nice low miles diesel bus. It kinda just depends on where you are as far as having lots of extra time and money on your hands and how soon you want he bus done.

As for the wood stove being dangerous and practical. If done right they can be both safe and very practical. Especially if you are going to be using the bus in the winter. You have to consider where your heat will be coming from(propane, electric, wood). We have propane and wood and rarely have enough electricity available for heat. I would seal up that pot belly, throw it in, and not look back.

Image

We need some pictures before we can help you any further. :lol:
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Jerry Campbell
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Post by Jerry Campbell »

I put cedar in the closets in my housetruck and will soon in my bus. I love it. BUT if you do any more than that the smell will be too strong.
Jerry
Stealth Camper
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Post by Stealth Camper »

Thanks to all for the thoughts. I appreciate it a great deal. I have been back and forth on a conversion quite a bit. I like the idea of "making the bus my own", but also suspect there will be more than enough work without digging into it that deep.

One scenario that has been coming to the fore more and more is to keep this bus as is for field trips. Up until a couple years ago (job loss, no money, much discord) I would regularly load it up with friends/family/casual strangers and take little jaunts. (Was only doing prelim work - seats out, stabilize rusty spots (primer) and work on mechanical.) Go to pizza place, visit local and surrounding town events, just little expeditions in about a 50 mile radius. Worth the money to keep the bus just for that. Seemed a shame to cut it up for a home and lose that function.

This bus gets 6 mpg. Has the 345 cu in.

Guess I might just change directions and head to diesel-ville.

Well, I thought about attaching a pic, but there was no cooperation in the computer side, so will have to wait.

Again, thanks!

[/img]
William Biffwinkle
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Post by William Biffwinkle »

stealth....you may want to start milling those logs and get them drying and shrinking long before you need them. That will also help with the smell decision.... :wink:
You cannot make a sow's ear out of a silk purse either.....but has anyone really tried to do both?

now heer in biffwinkleville we make deep fried DEEserts outa sows ears......an thayr ain't nuthin' stoopider lookin' than'n earless pig....
Stealth Camper
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Post by Stealth Camper »

Unfortunately, I began collecting logs before I had the sawmill. Am getting ready now to buy the mill (gonna be a Logosol for now), but some of the logs have been sitting for as much as three to four years. That's gonna hurt when start trying to mill.

I have halted accumulation for now. Our town has a "greenery dump" where people drop off limbs, trees, shrubbery, etc when it is taken out of landscape. The flip side is that people can go in at will (and free!) to get whatever of those piles of stuff they want. Sweet!! HUGE pile of firewood!! The lot covers probably 10 acres. They sort out logs from the pile to make it easier to get, too.

I have gotten white oak logs as big as 4 foot in diameter - 10 to 12 feet long. The guys working there were very kind to load them on my trailer for me, even if they did punch a hole in the 2x8 wooden deck.

At long last, I near the end of this note... I already have a pretty good stack of lumber from brother in law sawmill in Tennessee. He got rid of mill, or I would just go visit family and take a load of logs with me. Or better yet, just mill them with him there, and bring back the lumber.

Have some nice Sycamore here I am going to mill, though, so still need my own mill.

I DO like the smell of cedar!
Granny
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Post by Granny »

I couldn't resist adding a little trivia to this thread.
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Juniper
Have a look.
Stealth Camper
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Post by Stealth Camper »

That is very cool page. I like junipers - around here they kind of look like Christmas trees if you don't look too close. But they obliterate pasture at an incredible rate. Pasture is what Oklahoma is all about.

Juniperus virginiana

Called red cedar locally.
These things have overgrown southern Kansas and pretty much all of Oklahoma to the point where there are sporadic campaigns to obliterate. I will try to do my share when I get the mill up and running.

There is a turnpike that runs between Tulsa and Oklahoma City (parallel to Route 66) that is pretty much lined by juniper forests. There is one little section near Chandler (mile marker 166) where clearing has begun and the company doing the work has a sign posted by the road bragging about their tree work removing junipers.
dburt
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Post by dburt »

If the trees are big enough to mill into some suitable lumber for furniture making, they can yield some really nice furniture boards. Out here in Oregon, there are folks who make some really wild furniture out of "old growth" juniper. Of course this makes the radical meadow muffin tree huggers extremely upset!

You folks in Okie land need to be thankful that the extreme tree huggers have not migrated back there from the left coast yet. Otherwise, they would put a stop to any tree cutting, and shut down your entire economy if they could. In thier understanding of the earth and universe, people are at the bottom of the heap of importance.

The odd thing is, they never volunteer for elimination of themselves to help save the planet. They always want to help destroy someone else's livelihood and decrease some one else's excess population. I guess it's all a matter of perspective.
Last edited by dburt on Tue Jun 22, 2010 6:25 am, edited 1 time in total.
Jones'n4chrome
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Post by Jones'n4chrome »

dburt wrote:If the trees are big enough to mill into some suitable lumber for furniture making, they can yield some really nice furniture boards. Out here in Oregon, there are folks who make some really wild furniture out of "old growth" juniper.
Now Dennis....You know how important pics are when you make a statement like that! :D
dburt
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Post by dburt »

Uhh, pictures? :roll: I will try and see if I can find some related websites where one can go and see some cool pics of thier furniture. :)
Stealth Camper
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Post by Stealth Camper »

Okie-land only has scrub oak, a very few pines (many being killed by beetles) and in southern part of state, only two kinds of tree;

Cottonwood and
Dead cottonwood.

Ok, I exaggerate. Eastern half of state has a pretty good variety, going on into Arkansas and Missouri. Just wish it hadn't turned off so hot this week!! Geez...98 today. 60% humidity. Sucks. (I know - not really related to trees, but crap...it's hot! And today is only the first day of summer.)

We drive through Oregon from time to time (every few years visiting crazy family in Washington state.) and every time it seems like there are more and more clear cuts. Looking at it from Google Earth shows a real patchwork. East Tennessee has some of that going on from a pine beetle infestation. Brother's in law log there and there has been a lot of dead pine logging going on for a few years. You got pine beetles up there??
Stealth Camper
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Post by Stealth Camper »

Depending on the species (like virginiana) the junipers may not even be native to the area.

I am a certified, bona-fide, real life tree hugger. I love the things. I think they are arguably the human species best friend on the entire planet. And I cut them and use them. Burn them. Make "stuff" from them. Nothing exotic or fancy, just little stuff for now.

I would like to get a really big redwood sometime - the whole thing. Would use the bottom 40 feet to make into a really different home on wheels. There used to be one toured through here every year at the state fair. Big log made into a 'home' by carving out the interior. Pretty cool.

The rest, would mill into a lot of fireplace mantles, and have them carved by totem artist in Seattle area.

Found a pretty big log on a beach in Puget Sound over Christmas (2009) and was told that can't touch them on beach, but can drag if home if in the water. So now all I need is a boat and a really high tide that will float that puppy off the beach!
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